Connection Failure

I am sure there are lots of people who would want to help, but then what would be the first steps we or they can take? I mean those people who just live a normal life? A good discussion isn't really going to do anything to those we are talking about!
It seems like most people do wanna help but then we don't really know what we have to do or just give up in the long process. It really isn't easy to make a difference.

Poonte wrote:

"Also, Ashu, what is the problem with those promising, smart college-level students going to government colleges? Fees at TU campuses are affordable, I believe."


Sure, there are plenty of, say, Shanker Dev Campus graduates who are now
captains of Nepal's industries.

But these guys finished their education in the '70s and the '80s.

In recent years, it's got to a point where getting a decent, upwardly-mobile job-oriented education at state-run colleges has been very difficult to achieve for
MOST students because of two challenges.

First, the environment within such college-campuses operate has gotten worse from bad. It's impossible to just study -- and do well.

Second, the competition posed to those students at state-run colleges by others
who have studied in privately-run colleges (in Nepal and India) is getting bigger
and bigger.

All things being equal, these days, a bank in Kathmandu, for instance, is more likely to hire a KU MBA than a People's Campus MBS graduate.

That means, say, a Tharu young woman with an MBA from KU has a higher chance of landing a better job at a top-tier Kathmandu bank than a similar Tharu young woman with an MBS (with identical/higher . . . S = studies) grades from People's Campus.

[That most smart and capable young Tharu women do NOT pursue higher education, even after being rare enough to have been educated up to SLC level is a separate conversation for some other time.]

My idea: Find ways to make it easier to put historically underrepresnted ethnic minorities to attain job-oriented education (either in the form degrees such as MBA, accounting certifications, etc or short-term courses such as hair-dressing, cooking, computer programming, etc that enhances their attractiveness to the job market).

Once these people have paying jobs -- either jobs that they start for themselves or jobs they have by working for others -- they are more likely to be in a position to do more for their immediate families, communities and villages.

On a personal note, putting my own idea to practice, for the past two years, I
have been -- on a small scale (remember, I am not a millionaire . . . well, not yet
anyway!) -- sponsoring to put a young woman through a private law school in Nepal.

She's feisty, argumentative, has a mind of her own and very, very bright: just
the sort of lawyer I believe Nepal or the world needs in future. Let's see how this
assistance goes: so far, she is doing very well, and my additional assistance work consists of helping her find internships, make career-related networks and so forth.
Still, this remains a micro-scale personal work on the side.

Perhaps in future, well-organized charity institutions can find ways to INSTITUTIONALLY help smart and capable Nepalis in their 20s to start their own businesses and jobs . . . in an effort to help more Nepalis down the
line.

Just a thought.

oohi
ashu

A relevant post, copied-pasted from Becker-Posner Blog, Sept 2006

*****

Test Scores and Economic Performance-
by Gary BECKER

One of the challenging paradoxes during the past several decades is that American teenagers have consistently performed below average on international tests in math and sciences, and not especially well on reading tests, yet the American economy is more productive than any other.

Of course, an economy's productivity depends not only or even mainly on schooling, but also on its physical capital stock, institutions and laws, and various other variables as well. Even regarding human capital, however, the United States does better than suggested by its rankings in international tests.

Frequently cited are the results of tests in 2003 of 15-year-olds in math, sciences and reading. The U.S. ranked about 25th in math, 20th in science, and was above average in reading out of the about 40 countries that participated.

I believe these results correctly reflect that most American elementary and high schools are much less challenging in math and science than are schools in Finland, Japanese, Hong Kong, and other high scoring countries. However, the creation of valuable human capital for an economy depends on much more than is measured by tests of fifteen year olds in different subjects.

The philosophy behind U.S. education is to build up, so that later levels of schooling are more challenging than earlier levels. This means that more is expected of students at college than was expected of them in the high schools they attended, even though both high schools and colleges vary greatly in their degree of difficulty. On the other hand, secondary schools in most countries that rank high in these test scores give a lot of home work and expect a lot, while their colleges are often easier. In Japan, for example, getting into the top universities is very hard, but these universities are easy compared to the secondary schools that their students attended.

As it were, Japanese students rest in college after the exhausting demands of their high schools. Japan is an extreme version of a build down system, but less extreme versions are found in many of the other participating countries. This difference in education approach implies that a more relevant international comparison of the production of human capital would be to test not teenagers but young adults, say at age 22.

The U. S. would probably still perform below average in math and science, and might not excel in reading, but the relative performance of older Americans would be, I expect, considerably higher than that of fifteen or eighteen year olds.
Another important consideration in international comparisons of human capital is that a larger fraction of Americans than is common in other countries continue their learning after high school at junior colleges, trade schools, non-profit four-year colleges and universities, for-profit online education and universities, such as the University of Phoenix, adult education classes, and in other ways.

This vast array of learning opportunities allows young (and not so young!) persons to pick out programs that suit them, and to change where and what they are studying if they are dissatisfied. In most other countries, later as well as earlier schooling is not flexible. This again suggests that the human capital of Americans would look better in international comparisons if comparisons were not of teenagers but of adults in their late twenties and thirties.

U.S. education in junior colleges, many four-year colleges, at trade schools, and for-profit universities is more oriented toward improving job-relevant skills than is common in post secondary education in other countries. I refer not only to schools that teach how to drive a truck, use a computer, or cut and shape hair, but also to junior and four year colleges that provide instruction in landscape gardening, bookkeeping, and other practical subjects. This type of education may not help students know much about the world at large, but it does raise their productivity at work.

Another factor is intangible, but nevertheless is relevant in helping American men and women become innovative at work and in other parts of life. American schools are less oriented toward rote teaching than are schools in many other countries, and they are more oriented toward giving students practice in thinking through issues and expressing themselves in discussions.

Japan and the United States are outliers at opposite ends among rich countries in the degree of emphasis that schools place on thinking for oneself rather than memorizing information. The United States may go too far in its emphasis on "self expression" at the expense of teaching valuable knowledge and skills, but still international tests of subject matter knowledge, such as the 2003 tests, do not even try to capture originality and related important aspects of human capital accumulation.

Note in this regard that despite the mediocre record on international tests, American trained scientists do extremely well in garnering Nobel prizes and other international awards. American CEO's and investment bankers are ranked very high in the international business world for their energy and creativity, which is why many foreign companies have chosen Americans to head their operations. American workers also rank high when international businesses rank the quality of the workforce in different countries.

To be sure, a significant number of prominent "American" scientists and some business leaders were born abroad and immigrated to this country. This attraction to skilled immigrants must be taken into account in assessing the quality of the human capital that enters the American economy, although it may reflect unfavorably on the quality of education provided to American students in math and the sciences.

Still, if America allows India and other countries to pay the cost of training many of the engineers and other skilled workers who end up in the American economy, that is a pretty effective human capital production "system" when considered in its totality.

Ashu wrote:
for the past two years, I
have been -- on a small scale (remember, I am not a millionaire . . . well, not yet
anyway!) -- sponsoring to put a young woman through a private law school in Nepal.

Great job !

Poonte, Ashu

I will take the idea of "self evaluation".


Thank You all.

Hi Sirish,

In a spirit of kura-kani, two quick points.

First, it's NOT really great to "be sponsoring to put a young woman through a private law school in Nepal."

That's just INPUT -- which anyone can do.
Just happened to be me, in this small case.

What I've been talking about all along is OUTPUT -- how much bang you get out
the money you put in.

My point is: Assuming that money is scarce, which it always is, that bang is more
likely to be bigger with multiple effects if one spends some time to look to sponsor the education/job-related training of able, young and economically deserving and potential-/talent-displaying Nepalis.

In my case, if the young woman graduates to unemployment or underemployment after graduation, it really does NOT matter how much I have helped her. Her "knowing law" will be of little use if she cannot "use law" to make a living (and through advice, mentorship, caree-related networks and contacts, perhaps she can maximize her chances of getting a good job!).

So my request (again, in a spirit of kura-kani): Input is easy; collecting money to help Nepal is relatively easy; it's much harder to think about the output: how lives changed because of what we put in . . . this is where I would think the "Help Nepal 2.0" or any second-generation help-nepal programs should be looking at.

Just a thought.
**********************

Second, don't do "self-evaluation".
The results of self-evaluation will always be in our favor!

[That's why I am always amused to read about utterly self-serving "Maoist aatma-aalochana"!]

Being humans, we are all biased in favor of our own selves: and we tend to see our
own work in good light, while ignoring evidence that tells us otherwise. That's just human nature.

Go for a third-party evaluation -- evaluation by people who do not know you at all -- maybe in two to three years' time , because, from what I understand, Help Nepal is a relatively young organisation.

Just kurakani.

****
Meantime, on another note, am I crazy to dream of entire Nepal being connected
in four ways in near future:
- by road
- by ropeways and cable-lines
- by FM radio stations, and
- by national wi-fi internet connections?

Just dreaming.

oohi
ashu

Good to see that this thread is still running.
I liked the idea of grants and loans.The private banks in India do have educational loan programs.What about Nepali private banks??
Some questions regarding that:
-How to keep track of loan disbursed and make people accountable if they do not pay/leave the country?(Assuming Nepal does not have SSN tracking.)
-How about one person /one mentor approach as Ashu is following?That could also trigger the effect of "Pay it forward".
Ashu,the four dreams you talked about are 50% doable at this moment .
FM radios and Wi-fi.
I read about a guy in Nepal who had connected schools in the Himalayas by broadband.
I also read that FM radios imparting on-air classes for SLC students somewhere in the mountains.
Good to be back from Tihar and Mha puja.No bhai pooja for me . :-(

Tisa
No bhai pooja for me . :-(


same here !

interested in e-bhai tika ?

Had to reply to this qs.

Do we need SLC or its equivalent?
Methinks yes!
I gave the test too. Until class 9 anyone who has enough money will be promoted. But to actually competete with the rest of the country, we need a standardized test. I had/have friends who failed in Nepali and got like 80s in English in SLC, what a shame. Personally I think the English exams should be made much easier and math and science tougher.

If there was no SLC, among other factors, a school would be judged "good" based on how expensive the fee is. Though even now any school producing students who speak English fluently are called good, but how many students from these schools actually top SLC? Flawed eh?

Feel free to disagree.

Meera,

There's been some good studies on SLC by a team lead by Kedar B. Mathema -- former TU Vice Chancellor and Nepal's former ambassador to Japan (and if I may add, an all-round wonderful person who cares about educational issues as deeply as anyone I know).

I once summarized a few key findings of one of their reports (written by Dr. Saurav Bhatta) in my Nepali Times column, though in a 600-word pieces, one can only --
alas! -- scratch at the surface.

The article appears below -- if you are interested.

oohi
ashu

**********
Not doomed to failure
There are ways to raise the SLC pass rate

From Issue #292
(31 March 06 - 06 April 06)
The Nepali Times

By Ashutosh Tiwari

More than 330,000 students are taking this year’s School Leaving Certificate (SLC) exams, which started early this week. In June, we will find out that about 230,000 of those students failed.

We can make such a depressing prediction with confidence because even a casual look at the annual pass rates of the last two decades assures us that there is no other system in Nepal that produces more losers than winners than the SLCs.

If we add up only the number of regular candidates who have failed these annual exams since 1980 and compare the total to the number who passed, one conclusion is easy to draw: ours is a nation where a majority of literate adult citizens have repeatedly failed to earn even basic high school diplomas.

The implication of that conclusion is shocking—both for Nepal’s multiparty democracy, which requires informed and engaged citizens and for Nepal’s economic competitiveness, which demands skilled workers who can adapt to rapid changes in the marketplace.

And every June, commentators from all sides of the political spectrum moan obligatorily about the low SLC pass-rates and what that means for Nepal’s development. But within a day, they move on to write about the usual party-political tamasha, leaving these two questions forever on the table: why do so many Nepali students fail the SLCs and what can be done to help more of them succeed?

Researcher Saurav Dev Bhatta provides some answers. In a July 2005 study prepared for the Ministry of Education as a part of the SLC Study Team exercise, Bhatta attempts to tease out factors that determine students’ performance in the SLC exams and offers policy prescriptions. His method is to run regressions on piles of data gathered from 452 schools, 22,500 students, 5,625 families, 452 principals and 2,500 teachers, to conclude, among others:

• When students in the hinterland receive, at the beginning of their SLC years, grades 9 and 10 textbooks a month late, the likelihood of their finishing the syllabus is low. As a result, they are often unprepared for the exams. This problem could be addressed by getting books to students in villages and in remote areas on time.

• State-run schools hire teachers with BEd degrees. But instead of teaching at their assigned schools, such teachers are often found to be away—attending the Education Ministry’s various short-term training programs. As such, their frequent absenteeism appears to contribute to students’ poor results. This problem could be addressed by first acknowledging that the Ministry’s approach to teacher training appears to be negatively related to student performance and then taking steps to ensure that teachers stay in schools to actually teach and not hop on the next bus to Kathmandu for another training program.

• Schools with relaxed student-promotion policies, irregular testing schedules and poor homework policies tend to do worse in the SLCs. The stress needs to be on ways to encourage schools to raise student-promotion standards, administer more tests and assign and grade regular homework.

• Janjatis’ performance is significantly lower than that of Brahmins except in English and math courses. This indicates that the former might be at a disadvantage in courses that require strong Nepali language skills. Bhatta suggests having targeted policies to help the Janjatis.

Bhatta found out that students’ study habits, school conditions, family situations and community contexts have a significant impact on their SLC scores. The policy challenge now is to urgently tweak those variables so that more young Nepalis are on the path to earning their SLC or equivalent credentials. Anything less will continue to raise the cost of doing business in, and for Nepal, in coming years.

When talented and economically deserving ethnic minorities are NOT supported at critical times in their lives (i.e. at college/post-college levels), they miss out on prizes/awards/rewards like this.

No offence to the winners (I wish them well), but this is an example of what I have been talking about:

- http://www.fulbrightnepal.org.np/Nominees_for_the_Hubert_H_Humphrey_Fellowship_2007_2008.html

oohi
"let's make more Nepalis winners in their lives!"
ashu

Why only fulbright??You would see the same trend in most of the scholarships provided in Nepal.One could always argue that they are on merit basis but how can there be a competition between Kathmandu educated/trained students and some Dolpa kid who gets his books six months after the session has started.
The main problem in every sector in Nepal is TOO MUCH CENTRALISATION.

Ashu,

Good to see your articles and writings in this forum! How is work at TWB in Bangladesh...or have you moved on from there? I used to follow the book review in The New Biz Age mag. until few months back.

Friend @ CFG Project!

U r spot on regarding yr comment on centralization. I agree with you totally. It is very disheartening to see that despite lot of efforts from several gov'ts its ambitious de-centralization project never seems to have to have taken off. I used to know someone in the Min. of Local Dev. (some under-secretary) very closely, who used to lead this project supported by UNDP...I believe he left country totally frustrated.

I think (we) the Nepalis do have to come up with a very creative plan/strategy that will totally transform the way we get educated - starting from class 1. There has to be a significant and a radical paradigm shift in the structure and delivery mechanisms...basically no less than an educational revolution. I think that the current education system requires one to study to collect certificates for getting a better job rather than make use of the knowledge and skills one has garnered. We hardly seem to use 10% of what we study during our Masters and Bachelors degrees, of course with some exceptions. The education system could be made more focused, streamlined, practical and lot less expensive. We have to do away with the commercialization of the education that is rampant in all parts of the world, including our own. This is a modern day social disease we have been forced to live with. Education is too noble to be commercialized..but we can't resist it. I have come up with some ideas to neutralize this disease, but it may be little immature to bring it up here!

Dipanker,

Great to have you in the Sajha fold too.

For what it is worth, I'm an ancient geezer in this forum -- been posting stuff on Sajha since the year 2000; and, in the process, have made many, many good friends from around the world, and have learnt a lot from them, while inevitably managing to alienate quite a few people. Then again, as the Chinese say, "Never trust a person
with no enemies, for he's not living an honest life!" :-)

Yes, I am still based in BD -- a great platform to see, first-hand, the economic changes/social changes happening in the rest of South Asia.

*****

That said, those of you who are in Boston and are interested in scaling up educational work in Nepal, might be interested in attending this talk program at HBS.


What: Founder and CEO of "Room to Read", an organisation that has won numerous awards)

John Wood speaks on campus about social entrepreneurship and his journey

When: Monday October 30 th 12 – 1pm
Where: Harvard Business School Aldrich 10

Why: Come learn how a successful executive left and started up a phenomenal nonprofit that has changed the world through educating children in the developing world. Be inspired!

John Wood, CEO and Founder of Room to Read shares his personal story of an ex-Microsoft corporate executive who found his life's mission in educating the children of the world. His personal memoir " Leaving Microsoft to Change the World" has just been recently released.

Room to Read's vision is bold - to help 10 million children in the developing world gain the lifelong gift of education. Through their work, they hope to reach tens of thousands of communities in the developing world through Room to Read schools, scholarships, and libraries, and whole generations will have more opportunity and greater access to education than their parents.

Through their work, many more children in the developing world will grow up to have jobs and be able to invest in the future of their own country.

Through their work, Room to Read will be among the leaders in building, measuring, and evaluating education programs around the world. R oom to Read has won the Fast Company Social Capitalist Award four times, and is an exciting model of real social entrepreneurship. From its inception in 1999, to date it has accomplished the following across six countries: Vietnam , Cambodia , Laos , Nepal , Sri Lanka , India .

Constructing 221 schools
Establishing over 3,374 libraries
Publishing 99 new local language children's titles representing over 930,000 books
Donating over 1.2 million English language children's books
Funding 2,344 long-terms girls' scholarships
Establishing 108 computer and language labs

Come and be inspired by a real social entrepreneur who's acting to enact change in the world. Visit www.roomtoread.org for more details. We hope to see you there!

More about John's book online at http://www.leavingmicrosoftbook.com/ . Don't miss this rare opportunity to see him on campus!

CAREER: BEAUTY
Moon In The Gutters
The beauty business mushrooms in Bombay slums. It's a chance for the girls to chart a new life.

PAYAL KAPADIA


Like lotuses flowering in pools of green slime, beauty parlours are sprouting in the bowels of Dharavi, Bombay's—and Asia's—largest slum. Amidst tightly packed rows of shanties are dozens of dimly-lit 6x6 rooms, their walls painted bright green or pink. The reigning goddess of these parlours is undoubtedly Aishwarya Rai. From posters pasted on the lurid walls, she pouts winsomely down at mirrors chipped at the edges, scarred tabletops covered with cut-'n-paste formica, and stacks of bottles and jars—mostly unlabelled. Outside, a proud signboard announces your arrival at Prasanna Beauty Parlour, Roza Beauty Parlour, Nikhar Beauty Parlour, Sunita Beauty Parlour....

Sunita, owner of the eponymous parlour ("why you want to know my husband's name—he's good for nothing."), is busy taking appointments on her mobile phone. She dreams of expanding her business by training more slum girls to work in her parlour. And even of attracting a steady stream of smart clients from the nearby IT hub at Andheri East.

Across town in South Mumbai's Colaba slums, a path made slippery by soapsuds and overhung with gnarled cables leads you past cats scrounging in the garbage to a flight of rickety metal steps. If you know where to go, you'll climb up, making the leap of faith across the chasm of a stairwell to enter the tube-lit one-room tenement that every woman in this slum knows as Eshan Beauty Parlour. The interiors reek of the sweet odour of hair-removing wax, a battered two-in-one plays Pehla Nasha, and black ants circle a torn patch on the linoleum floor. In one of the two rickety chairs sits 22-year-old Pushpa who gave birth to her first child only a month ago and still made the time to come and get her eyebrows threaded.

Staunch feminists may scoff at the 'beauty business', but these modest slum parlours are giving wings to the aspirations—big and small, of a motley lot of women from the jhopadpattis—bais who have keenly observed their memsahibs dress up for years; housewives who find this a good way to earn from home; college students who want to ape their hipper South Mumbai counterparts; and young office workers who want to look like career women.

For Pinky, who's training under Tamanna didi at the Eshan Beauty Parlour, a beautician's job offers an exit from the slums and an escape from the drudgery of washing vessels for rich people, as her mother did. "I want to do work that is more respected," she says.

At the Femina Beauty Clinic, in a slum overlooking the historic Banganga Tank, five young girls attend an afternoon training session. Two of them are maids in private homes. Once they've completed their course, they can earn around Rs 2,000 a month at one of the slum parlours—and up to Rs 7,000 a month if they get into 'self-service'—going from house to house, waxing legs and giving facials at well-to-do homes. For now, they practise on Suvarna, daughter of a government peon, who will wash off all tell-tale traces of powder, blusher, mascara and kohl before she goes home.

Running a parlour in the city's poorest areas is challenging. The rate list must be kept modest: only Rs 10 for threading eyebrows, a basic haircut for Rs 50. Competition is cut-throat, calling for savvy marketing through mobile phones, and strategic undercutting of each others' prices. Anu Salunkhe, owner-proprietor of Diksha Beauty Parlour, does eyebrows for Rs 7 to lure away customers from other parlours in Dharavi. Thrift and recycling are a way of life here: freshly cut hair makes its way, not into garbage bins, but—at a price—to other women who make braids and hair-switches for a living. There are thugs to ward off too, the taporis who harass parlour owners.

With all of that, parlours manage to make at least Rs 5,000 per month, their average intake of 10 clients a day, trebling during the wedding and festival seasons.And so, there's no limit to dreaming. Many parlour owners are saving towards renovating, renting or buying a small place "in a better-off area where clients have more money, and can pay more." They are boning up on banks and business loans—and yes, even aspiring for political careers. In Shankarwadi slum, Vaishali Salve hopes her clients will help her get elected in next year's municipal elections.

Lata, 40, has turned dreams into reality. Twenty years ago she sold dhania mirchi on the pavement. Now she owns a 9th floor flat and a 300 sqft parlour in Chembur, an East Bombay suburb. "I'm worth Rs 80 lakh and it's all declared income," she laughs. Paisa by paisa, Lata saved up for a beautician's course, became a parlour-owner, and even travelled to London for a Vidal Sassoon diploma. Now she's acquired a 1,000-sqft plot for a swank new parlour.

Meanwhile, Tamanna didi dreams, and in the slow interim between the dreaming of dreams and their fruition, she keeps a tube of St Ives Apricot Scrub on her shelves. It is empty—none of her customers can really afford to use it—but it's a symbol of better days to come.
Outlook India.

Tisha,

A great story . . . from Outlook magazine!

Reading this kind of stuff literally makes my day!

Helping people start and sustain their own commercial businesses is one
ADDITIONAL (and arguably more return-giving) way to help Nepal.

In small towns across Nepal, many women have become self-reliant by
being small-business owners who run their own "beauty parlors".

If my memory serves me right, three years ago, when this famous Indian hairdresser called Habib (I think that is his name) came to KTM and gave a presentation at Hotel Soaltee, more than half of his audience (of about 600 or so women) was composed of beauty-parlor owners from OUTSIDE of KTM Valley.

They had come to KTM, at their own expenses, to pick up hair-styling skills from this master. And they were not rich businesswomen -- just hardworking women (most were former housewives) who were then proud to run their own parlors in Butwal, Nepal Gunj, Damauli and the like!

oohi
ashu

Isn't it funny that a thread about three women running for a 'small' cause turns into a chautari discussion of god knows what.. patting of each others' back for ideas that died with this thread itself and totally taking the focus away from the three generous souls who just want to build a damn hospital in a damn village. Learn to use the 'New Thread' button you old geezers.

Congratulations to the girl who finished the NYC marathon and good luck to the other two girls running in the Philly marathon on the 19th. I apologize on behalf of all these people who have their heads up their asses.

Republican-ji,

Maybe you do, but some of us do NOT live in an EITHER-OR world, as in 'either you are for this or you are against this' world.

Some of us live in an "AND THAT TOO" world.

Please allow me to explain.

One can surely and sincerely wish, as all HAVE done above, these three ladies well and the organization Help Nepal all the best.

AND, AND and AND

Having wished one's best, one can THEN carry on with public conversations about
what else out there might "help" Nepal.

It is in the spirit of AND THAT TOO that the conversations above flowed easily.

Now will everyone agree with everything's that written/commented on above?
No.

Should they?
No.

But should there be room for different/tangential/variously-angled views on this and other topics?
Yes.

Should having such room make the marathon runners' work any less significant?
No.

So?

Republican-ji, live in an "and that too" world; and give up viewing the world in an "either this or that" tone.

People are just sharing views -- NOT imposing them on others -- and reasonable people always have differences of opinions on just about everything everywhere.

oohi
ashu

Should having such room make the marathon runners' work any less significant?
No.

------
Well, ashuman, it has. Because their efforts were buried deep among all the 2-paisa talk.

You can yap all you want, I won't care. I didn't ask you to stop it. I said make a new thread. The button's free.

Republican,

Let us agree to disagree -- and leave it at that.

******

Others,

Let's keep on yapping here and elsewhere.

This space DESIGNATED for kurakani -- in all its its heterogenous forms.
And as the Nepali saying goes, kuro and kulo go anywhere you want them
to go!

Happy yapping here about this and many other topics.

oohi
ashu